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Post by ivonko on Oct 15, 2012 14:42:13 GMT -5
Hello all, my name is nick, I'm new to this forum and new to 3 cylinders and justys
So here's the story
I picked my very first just just 2 days ago. It started up rough but held idle and ran just fine after that, I did notice that there was a lot of oil on the block (Iread on here that leaking is common) but we did make sure it was topped off with all fluids before we left, we also noted that the radiator fan wasn't working but the ambient temps were in the low 50s so we let that slide till we were to get home.
So we drove out, unfortunantly all the speedlimits around there were 60 which is more than Iwanted to push the poor thing but people began getting upset with me. So I went 60.
Drove about 60 miles then suddenly felt a partial loss in power (lasted about 10 seconds) Igot into the left lane to start. pulling over then Iheard an audible POP (not super loud) and the car lost all power. I pulled over and popped the hood, a pressurized stream of coolant was coming out near the line dividing head and block, but also seemed to come down to (where Ibelieve) the water pump is sealed.
Needless to say I didn't try starting her up again and we towed her home
My question
If anybody can give me a educated guess as to what happened and what damage may occur to the motor from this sort of incident.
Thanks!
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Post by ivonko on Oct 15, 2012 14:49:54 GMT -5
A bit of additional info
Justy was a 89 carb'ed version, 4wd, 129k miles (as indicated by last oil change) 29k on odo. Was sitting for 3 years in a yard on the coast, then driven for about 1 month by a new owner before being sold to me.
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Post by nipper on Oct 15, 2012 17:03:05 GMT -5
I havent heard of these things popping a head gasket, but it is possible. I would however start with something simple like a stuck thermostat. I would check the oil level and try to star it just to see if it cranks and fires.
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Post by Cañon Carver on Oct 15, 2012 17:12:08 GMT -5
Nick you need to post up pics as soon as you can so we can see what's leaking and where.
-Jamie
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Post by Armageddous on Oct 15, 2012 20:23:07 GMT -5
Being a carb motor it's possible the engine got so hot that the mixture was too poor and it simply backfired out of the intake. As far as the steam shooting out that's a good indication of a leak. The fact it was steam tells me that the engine ran out of coolant, which is bad. I agree with nipper, I would also add doing a compression check for any real obvious issues. If the head gasket shot out the side then you will almost certainly need a new cylinder head because it will be shaped like a banana.
Terry
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Post by ivonko on Oct 15, 2012 23:21:36 GMT -5
thanks for all the advise guys jamie wednesday i will be tearing into her and will take a lot of pics, i only got to inspect her at night so couldnt take photos @terry it was full of coolant, all of the coolant shot out of that crack all at once lol, after that i am sure it was empty though lol, i will do a comp test though just to double check, whats the comp supposed to be at on them normally? (really hoping the head and block are both fine) nipper i havent tried starting it back up since it blew, think it would be safe to start up to see if it runs for a few seconds without coolant? again thank you guys so much! ill be sure to update on what happens, this justy is way to amazing for me not to get it running today i ordered the following; headgasket, valve cover gasket, timing belt, water pump, spark plug wires, plugs, no matter what the issue was i was planning on replacing all these anyway so it is in ship shape. i think i will also add thermostat to the list as well now that you mention it.
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Post by Armageddous on Oct 16, 2012 20:50:57 GMT -5
I'm not really sure what it should be. I would be more looking for one cylinder that is more than 10% different, if the head or a valve is bad then it will be very low. Just make sure once the head is off you get it resurfaced (machined) because if it got that hot, chances are the head is now warped.
Terry
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Post by ivonko on Oct 18, 2012 2:01:27 GMT -5
small update, all my parts for the car arrived today via amazon prime also went out to the car today to see how she is doing in the corner of my buddies property. i poured in water into the radiator to see if i can repeat the leak, i found that the water came out ONLY around the water pump cover, my best guess is that the water pump stopped working and the pressure built up causing that gasket or the cover to go out, i also attempted to start the car just to see what will happen (didnt force her too hard to not flood the carb) the car attempted to start but wouldnt turn over, one large possibility is that the timing belt snapped if the water pump stopped turning preventing the car from starting up. i am hoping that tomorrow i will be able to start tearing into the justy and hopefully get it running either this or next week, then will go on to my planned projects with it
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Post by Armageddous on Oct 18, 2012 20:54:20 GMT -5
Sounds like a plan. FYI, the water pump is driven by the balance shaft which is driven by the balance shaft chain, which also drives the oil pump on the other side. This is not a conventional engine design. Terry
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Post by ivonko on Oct 19, 2012 1:45:35 GMT -5
lol i was wondering what the heck was running the water pump, i could definitely see it isnt hooked to the timing belt lol so heres where im at: today i went out and tore apart part of the engine, pulled the timing belt, water pump, alt. belt, everything on that side of the engine basically, i love how easy this engine is to work on, largest bolt i removed was a size 17 on the crank pulley lol (thank you harbor freight for your amazing 20 dollar electric torque gun that you sold me at discount price) i discovered that the previous owner, or maintainer of the car had installed the water pump without a gasket and tried to compensate by putting in permatex gasket maker, i also found a piece in my new bosch water pump kit that wasnt installed in the engine, i was curious as to what the piece might be ill post a pic of it. saturday will be the main install, timing belt, water pump (WITH GAKSET ), cam seal, spark plugs and wires, and valve cover gasket anything else in the same general area (gaskets or anything) that i should do while im there??? it cant be anything that takes a lot of work outside of what i have already done because i need to get that car off my buddies property asap some pics,, just the engine bay carphotos.cardomain.com/images/0015/29/29/15989292_large.jpgthe timing belt area taken apart, note all the oil/grease crap everywhere that needs to be cleaned up lol carphotos.cardomain.com/images/0015/29/99/15989299_large.jpgthis is the part thats in the new water pump that wasnt in the old one... what is it??? carphotos.cardomain.com/images/0015/29/69/15989296_large.jpgand here is the worthless gasket that was used for the water pump... carphotos4.cardomain.com/images/0015/29/89/15989298_large.jpg
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Post by Armageddous on Oct 19, 2012 11:54:52 GMT -5
Wow what a slimy engine you have. The part you're referring to is #7 on that diagram. Every water pump has a mechanical seal but it's usually integrated. It really should be replaced but it is very very hard with the crank case on the engine (or the engine in the car). If you look in the housing that the water pump came out of with a mirror you will see it. It is a very easy seal to mess up so I would recommend only replacing it if you're going to have really good access to it. The torque spec for the harmonic-balancer is around 75ft/lbs. Make sure you get it there, they have a habit of falling off. If you can locate a new oil pump you should replace that as well, it is locate under the 3 bolt cover, opposite side of the crank as the water pump. Make sure you get all 4 pieces - inner rotor, outer rotor, seal and cover plate. I would also check your distributor cap for wear/oil contamination and clean as necessary. Also make sure you apply a sealant (liquid teflon or equivalent) to the long 14mm head bolt that came out of the water pump cover.
Terry
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Post by ivonko on Nov 2, 2012 4:50:41 GMT -5
first off thanks for the awesome info everybody, my parts finally came in, engine is still torn apart unfortunantly due to weather and lack of garage but looking into the water pump area (took a pic with the phone sorry about quality) it really doesnt look like the "mechanical seal" that was mentioned above is even in there, unless i am missing something carphotos2.cardomain.com/images/0016/65/64/16005646_large.jpgtheres the pic, i also decided not to get an oil pump at this time, i hope i dont regret this decision in the future,i will make sure that i apply sealant to said 14mm bolt. again thanks for the info, i really hope i can have a real update on this soon.
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Post by Armageddous on Nov 2, 2012 11:19:17 GMT -5
That is the seal with the balance shaft sticking through it, just trust me. Terry
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Post by Cañon Carver on Nov 2, 2012 13:30:57 GMT -5
I can get a better pic of my spare block and balance shaft if you need Nick.
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Post by ivonko on Nov 3, 2012 1:17:27 GMT -5
ok i trust you so whats the method of pulling it out without pulling the crank case lol jamie nah i dont think i will need a pic unless you can take a pic of how to pull it out?
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